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| [poll] Team Balance | ||
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| AwsedreswA |
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Registered Member #223
Joined: Wed Apr 26 2006, 10:53PMPosts: 126 |
Here is some data from FTC--Taken 4am 11-10-06 9 out of 10 of these top players (with more than 200 hours of play) win more on T side. Some 2 to 5 times more often. They do, however, tend to join the side they win more also, but not near the same ratios as their victories. Notice that the join ratio is more often closer than the win ratio is, to 1. This strengthens the idea that one is more likely to win on the T side, regardless of the frequency they join on the T side. I can agree that better people on a team can influence whether the team wins or not. However, this data shows that people are generally "better" on T. This kinda makes you wonder, is T winning becuase they are better, or because they are T? I suggest we have a test period of no admin interference with the balancing of teams, short of an admin switching themselves. That means no money (unless both teams get it, I'm sure some people are addicted to giving themselves 16k), no health, and no forcibly swapping players. Let mani do it, after a week of no admin intereference we will see if it was even necessary. P.S. I think it is reveiling that Abs and Goose can't make a rebuttle without an insult. Really shows the strength of their character and the validity of their points. |
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| aborted fetus |
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The All-Cum Diet
Registered Member #47
Joined: Mon Dec 05 2005, 04:55PMPosts: 1888 |
Jesus Christ. Edited Sat Nov 11 2006, 01:36AM |
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| Pockyninja |
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Ruler of all that is pocky
Registered Member #28
Joined: Mon Nov 28 2005, 11:17PMPosts: 704 |
Look man drop it you lost that one. When something like this happens you should take it with respect and digenty looking to see how you can improve yourself not all the problems with the system. In fact from the data that dose seem clear it was stacked in some fasion. Nether of your choices here are correct there are times when the teams just need motivating and there are times when they really are stacked. You have to find the balance of all things and I dont mean the teams in this sence. Your action here are not showing a good level of maturaty. I am sure that if you had just taken the hit and then tryed hard and got better at some point you could have asked alex for another chance but if you keep fighting a battle which you can not win it will most likely have negtive results and not postive. Please just let it pass. Learn from the exsperence you dont need to get so uptight about lossing admin. All things in the universe need balance useage of power especally. Edited Sat Nov 11 2006, 02:01AM |
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| emerican |
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Registered Member #164
Joined: Tue Mar 07 2006, 12:07PMPosts: 3146 |
when teams are stacked i try to unstack and go to the other team | ||
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| aborted fetus |
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The All-Cum Diet
Registered Member #47
Joined: Mon Dec 05 2005, 04:55PM Posts: 1888 |
Team balance helps sustain a popular server. Look, FTC is not the most popular server in the entire FT community by accident. We look at trends on the server: what helps, what doesn’t. As a result, the players thank us by making FTC the most played server in the FT community by leaps and bounds. Awse, you’re being awfully cavalier with the health of the server. If you’re wrong, the server suffers big time. We will lose connections. But, you’re willing to risk it because you have nothing to lose. You don’t have a vested interest in the server. Edited Sat Nov 11 2006, 03:03AM |
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| alcosatz |
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FT Classic Op
Registered Member #39
Joined: Fri Dec 02 2005, 10:30PMPosts: 1545 |
First off, let me say that I applaud your persistence in wanting to explore what we understand as team balance. Your poll choices blow, and if I gave into my spiteful nature I would create a thread with a poll asking this:
A vote for A. is a vote for you, Awese, a former admin that had nothing more to contribute than sucking your thumb like an ineffective fuck. AwsedreswA wrote ... Here is some data from FTC ... 9 out of 10 of these top players (with more than 200 hours of play) win more on T side. Some 2 to 5 times more often. They do, however, tend to join the side they win more also, but not near the same ratios as their victories. Notice that the join ratio is more often closer than the win ratio is, to 1. This strengthens the idea that one is more likely to win on the T side, regardless of the frequency they join on the T side. I can agree that better people on a team can influence whether the team wins or not. However, this data shows that people are generally "better" on T. This kinda makes you wonder, is T winning becuase they are better, or because they are T? What are you trying to prove? That skilled players tend to win, and that more of them gravitate towards one team on a 24/7 office server? Far fucking out... The data you included justifies your point but what FTC as a whole? You know, the 36,957 that have connected this year: -[link]- but nothing that would corroborate your theory. I still have no idea what you are trying to assert, especially when I look at the poll you included with this thread. Showing how often particular players win or lose without knowing with whom they are playing is pointless. AwsedreswA wrote ... I suggest we have a test period of no admin interference with the balancing of teams, short of an admin switching themselves. That means no money (unless both teams get it, I'm sure some people are addicted to giving themselves 16k), no health, and no forcibly swapping players. Let mani do it, after a week of no admin intereference we will see if it was even necessary. Thanks for your suggestion. I can understand that you would like to see the results of no admin intervention (what you so curmudgeonly refer to as "interference") when in comes to team balance to prove a point. Honestly, I don't think following your suggestion would translate to a mass exodus of FTC regulars. Hypothetically, though, you should consider that team balance has been stated as an admin responsibility as well as other circumstances that warrant admin intervention. What if, in addition to not having admins balance teams we told players that it is up to them to voteban/votekick TK/FF'ers. What if we told them it is up to them to enforce all the rules and no admins are required? It may yet work -- force players to show personal responsibility in resolving problems instead of relying on administrators to resolve those problems. I'm sure dropping admin support would be a facinating social experiement which may revolutionize how server operators and players approach online FPS gaming. Unfortunately, we're not trying it here. Team balance stays, and I encourage all admins to redouble their dedication. AwsedreswA wrote ... P.S. I think it is reveiling that Abs and Goose can't make a rebuttle without an insult. Really shows the strength of their character and the validity of their points. I find the poll on this thread very revealing of your character. Giving players the option to either "give up" or "deal with it" is a joke. Edited Sat Nov 11 2006, 03:18AM |
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| jb |
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Registered Member #477
Joined: Thu Nov 02 2006, 03:47AMPosts: 104 |
LOL - I have heard complaints about "Team Stacking" for years. I personnaly always Autochoose sides when i join. It is more fun to just play the hand dealt you and do allyou can to win and have fun. Ct can win if you have only one leader, so make the choice to be a leader on teh losing team. When you win that way you can feel great about your play and take joy in pwning the "stacked" team. I have only been playing on this server for a few weeks now but I have seen many good players join the losing side to address the challenge of turning it into a winner. Caine, TrueEagle, Airborne Aggie, Vulture to name a few. I say pucker up and play for the fun of it. Bitching about stacking is worthless and nothing more than childish whining. |
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| Knightrider |
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Meteor 2016
Registered Member #316
Joined: Mon Jun 26 2006, 09:14PMPosts: 3503 |
jb wrote ... I say pucker up and play for the fun of it. Bitching about stacking is worthless and nothing more than childish whining. When people are bitching about the stacked teams, they arent having fun. Dont you get angry at all when your team is getting their asses handed to them? I have mentioned this in another thread..People sometimes do not play the game for the fun of it. You get the stat whores, that have to be number one in every server. You get the pubstars that are problems for stackage. Its just all in the matter of swapping them to the losing team, and making them win. Nobody wants to lose 10 rounds in a row after getting raped round after round by the same people. Its not really bitching, its frustration from lack of support. |
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| BuBBLe GooSe |
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The Original MilfHunter
Registered Member #163
Joined: Mon Mar 06 2006, 02:24PMPosts: 1592 |
AwsedreswA wrote ... P.S. I think it is reveiling that Abs and Goose can't make a rebuttle without an insult. Really shows the strength of their character and the validity of their points. Valid points are still valid, regardless of the delivery. Go to the other thread regarding this topic and make some rebuttles. I guess you got owned and don't want to show your face in that thread so you had to start another one. You are not in the position to be making judgments regarding people's character. I'm sure that many people can judge your character based on these past few threads. Eh dude, at least I make rebuttles. I recall when we were trying to outline a new voting procedure and you managed to 'spam' your idea for a procedure 5 times in 5 seperate threads? I replied to each of the 5 times and yet you didn't acknowledge that a reply was given (cuz you don't read what other people write) and you continue on, posting the same shit on other threads, like you are doing now. The wording used to outline this 'poll' is clearly biased as Alex pointed out. You were not enforcing server rules and you were fired. Chew on your sour grapes in private and with your mouth closed because this is kinda annoying. Not balancing teams is like not banning the hacker, not punishing the TKer, not muting the spammer... Not doing what an admin is expected to do. You are NOT an admin anymore. I do NOT care what you have to bitch about because you don't make any logical or noteworthy points. Where was this argument back when you had admin? You will NOT change anyone's mind because your argument lacks substance. Teambalancing has proved to be beneficial and the proof is in the connection count. Bottom Line: Awsedreswa, you did not enforce server rules, and as a result, you lost admin privledges. Teambalancing has proved to be beneficial, you have not shown any valid argument to the contrary. Bubble Goose sez: Keep chewing on those sour grapes, because all thats coming out of your mouth is whine. You didn't do your job, so that's why,,,  |
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| AwsedreswA |
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Registered Member #223
Joined: Wed Apr 26 2006, 10:53PM Posts: 126 |
TK/FF is off the subject. Having a vote to change that is a lot harder (admin intervention helps) takes more than one attentive guy otherwise. However you guys say that switching one person can balance teams, that can be done without admin, by the free will of "good sport" players. Personally, if you can't handle losing 4 rounds straight, I dont want you on my team. You're a pussy if you call unfair teams that soon. AP said... That right there is weak kung fu, I thought you were stronger than that. I'm sure many people will agree that my admining was effective in many aspects. Very funny kicking me when I said you had weak kung fu, funny. Thanks for the link, that does corroborate my theory. Not a very stong correlation, but there none the less. T wins more even in spite of CT being joined more. AP said... And what I was getting at with the data, that unbalance is natural in the game. I don't know how to get a measurement of team skill per team win. So I went with those that had more than 200 hours to get a sample that would include both good and bad teams, so it wouldn't be pointless from the lack of more complex data. The poll was meant to see how many people play the game a certain way, how does that blow? AP said.... Who said there would be? Pocky, admin efforts to balance teams are excessive. Prove it wrong. Support the test and see how many non-FT members ask for teams to be balanced. Vote system is off the subject. Oh and Goose 'I got owned in the last thread,' I thought that responses to the thread were divided. I guess you were looking at what you wanted to. I started a new thread beacuse that shit had 3 pages full of retort and excerpts of other people's posts. I put this to you Goose, prove admin action to team balancing is beneficial and reveal the pitfalls of its absence by supporting my proposed test of no admin action to balance teams. |
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